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Reply with quote  #31 
Splotchy everything you say here i just so true.I was also raised by some type of parents that i didn't know what was really going on until they got split and my mother had already met a new man.As a child i thought that the situation was ok because they had a lot of friends coming to our home and things seemed to be very good because there were a lot of partys or celebrations going on.I couldn't spot any signs as a child.Because people who have narcissitic or borderline features can hide them well when they are with people not directly close and related to them this mask did a great work for all these people outside of the direct family members.Sometimes they broke up with some good people, i remember that as a child but i didn't pay attention to this.Internally i dont really want to discuss things with them about me not only because i can't but also because after all these horrible things they have said to me don't even make want to approach to make the effort.They are unavailable when you really need them.They have learned these stereotypes from their parents and i suspect they never did any simple move to do what is better for them.Pity.Ok im in very early adulthood and i have understood that i have to leave shortly to not allow anything like this.I don't even believe it.Just how?I f you are ok person you can do something you want.If a person thinks like this its fine.But for my parents well that's something they possibly can't do.Perhaps the problem in this undescribable situation is all the verbal and emotional blackmail that i have recieved all this time that i won't tolerate anymore.I have strengthen myself, it worked and i feel freedom is coming close.I don't need their help much if not all.Best wishes to you.
Reply with quote  #32 
What helps me to heal is my husband and my children and grandchildren.
Also excersing and realizing that I'm happier since I went No Contact.
My N Mother just can't and willl never stop verbally abusing me.
She really doesn't think there is anything wrong with her.
They do so much damage to us and I'm feeling stronger everyday that
I don't need her in my life treating me horrible. 
The last two years before I went no contact everytime I called her just
to see how she was she would burp really loud into the phone and just kept
it up until I said goodbye.  Inbetween that she was tearing me down verbally
and my entire family. 
I felt I had nothing left to do but to leave and go no contact.
I don't know what damage should would have inflicted on me as
I got older.  It was getting way to much to handle.
During all this I never said one unkind thing to my mother as she waged
this verbal war against me and my family only it was getting worse as she
got older. 

This board was a life saver for me, I would still be letting her suck the life out
of me if I had not found all of you.   For that there are no words to say but
a huge THANK YOU from the bottom of my heart.

So much pain it was a lifetime worth of pain and suffering at my N Mother's
But we are making it out of their webs and beginning to live and to be happy
and to discover that we are loveable and we are worthy of happiness.

Reply with quote  #33 
Wanted to clairify that when I never spoke unkind to her ever, it was not to make
myself feel like I was such a great person, it is with these personalities they make
you feel so insecure and so unloved that you don't have the right to say anything
back to them.   If I had been stronger and secure I would have stood up to her
but being beat down on a day to day basis and their rage we just let them contnue
to beat us down.   I want to be able to help others to know you have a right to
stand up for yourself when you are being abuse whether physicallly or mentally.
Just because they are a parent does not give them the right to treat you so poorly.
I thought I was not good enough and therefore just let her verbally abuse me
and I stood there and took it most of my life.

Afterall it was embedded in us to obey our Fathers and Mothers.
We had no voice!
Even in my 50's it was embedded and she was so controlling and
just so mean!
Actually N's can be very scary people!  The Rage they have is beyond

Reply with quote  #34 
Distance - physical and emotional
Freedom - to control my own life, try new things, push myself without being told I'll fail
Healthy relationships
Achieving things (and nolonger telling my mother - so she can't criticise or belittle)
Finally "getting it" thanks to this board, books, other sites
Pets - unconditional uncomplicated love and the right priorities - food shelter company
Being outdoors in wild country - walking, running, kayaking, camping
Caller ID

Reply with quote  #35 
I also have this on my desktop so I can open and read it as I need to

Go placidly amid the noise and haste,
and remember what peace there may be in silence.
As far as possible without surrender
be on good terms with all persons.
Speak your truth quietly and clearly;
and listen to others,
even the dull and the ignorant;
they too have their story.

Avoid loud and aggressive persons,
they are vexations to the spirit.
If you compare yourself with others,
you may become vain and bitter;
for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.
Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.

Keep interested in your own career, however humble;
it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.
Exercise caution in your business affairs;
for the world is full of trickery.
But let this not blind you to what virtue there is;
many persons strive for high ideals;
and everywhere life is full of heroism.

Be yourself.
Especially, do not feign affection.
Neither be cynical about love;
for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment
it is as perennial as the grass.

Take kindly the counsel of the years,
gracefully surrendering the things of youth.
Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune.
But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.
Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.
Beyond a wholesome discipline,
be gentle with yourself.

You are a child of the universe,
no less than the trees and the stars;
you have a right to be here.
And whether or not it is clear to you,
no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God,
whatever you conceive Him to be,
and whatever your labors and aspirations,
in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams,
it is still a beautiful world.
Be cheerful.
Strive to be happy.

Reply with quote  #36 
 Love that poem Branwen!! So inspirational!!

About 5 years ago I started realizing my mom had mental issues. I was going thru a rough time in life and suddenly it was more than I could cope with. I started searching the web for answers. I discovered that she is an N. Every article was her to a tee! Now I knew and the question was "how do I heal" At age 56 and 5 years later that process has begun..

 I had to stop feeling it was something I was doing wrong

I stopped catering to her every need

I paid no more attention to her emails beginning "we're still alive" Lol!!
they all begin that way... the we is her and stepdad

I ignore her non-stop chatter about herself and step-dad
I only send short, non emotional replies
If I listened to her she'd be dying today and step-dad would have every disease in the book

Opened communication with my oldest brother. For years we didnt discuss her. I thought he didnt feel like I do. Then he called we talk all the time about moms issues and its great having his support. Talking to others that understand is key to healing...

I dont cry anymore, when I accepted that she cant be the mom of my dreams, the tears stopped

I limit contact..rarely see her

Never ever tell her my health issues, they always get ignored and I've stopped getting angry about that. I am nothing more than an extension of her..she CANNOT see me as an individual. When I aaccepted this A weight was lifted.

I live my live for myself first, my hubby, my children, my grandkids. This is where the Love is, the joy.  Begin with those who see you as a joy in their lives

These are just a few steps I've taken......

Had to add this, just saw it on another site

Question..How many children does it take to change an N mothers lightbulb"

Answer...None, "You just go on daughter and have fun, I'm fine here in the dark"'ve probably seen that one before but wow does it sum up an N!!!

Blessings to all and hope its a beautiful day!!


Late Bloomer
Reply with quote  #37 

I would like to know if Tanya is still hanging in there. Her situation so much resembled mine.  Let me know how things are with you and your family Tanya. I had no choice but to leave my marriage.  With counseling and my own family holding me up, its been a challenge. I just could not oversee the mind,body control my NMIL has on my husband.  Reading Toxic Parents has opened my eyes to how really ill my husband is and comfirmed I am doing the right thing. I have begun my own journey of recovery and know I have a long way to go but taking the first measures is the toughest and I'm now on the exciting yet scary path to emotional healing and understanding. This support group has been invaluable.THANK YOU ALL ! 

Reply with quote  #38 

Does anyone recommend a support group for ACONs?  I am going through a divorce from a man with narcissistic tendencies, and grew up with a narcissistic mother. I can't really turn to my family in these times, because they turn my needs around on me and tell me how selfish I am for having them. I have a limited social network because I have moved multiple times in my life.  I feel like I have a lot of processing to do, and could benefit from a group with similar issues. Any ideas?

Reply with quote  #39 
There are a few support groups for ACONS.  Some of the support boards, like this one, are open to all.  Some are by invitation only, to protect the members from lurkers that do so much damage.  I have a list of books and websites you may find helpful.  Everyone is welcome to email me for my list.

Reply with quote  #40 
Glad to have found this forum.  I am in need of some advice from children of narcissists.

I have 3 grown girls (21, 24 & 26) with the ex  N (married for 18 years divorced for 10)   I have tried to be there, however ex n makes its impossible to have a real relationship with them.  You will all know what I mean. 

To my current dilemma:  My ex n remarried a couple of year after we divorced.  He has recently been charged and committed to stand trial for sexually  molesting his 14 year old step daughter.  (I know a man is innocent until proven guilty but its hard to lie for 15 pages in a statement and the story has my ex N written all over it).  He has my daughters convinced that it is all lies and the ex wife and daughter are after his money.  There is a lot more to this story but I am trying to get the point of my distress.

OK, I have not been able to have a real conversation with any of my girls about it.  They have been sworn to secrecy by their N dad. I do not want to push them at present, it will only turn to resentment and make me more the enemy.

I believe he will be found guilty.  I am not sure how to be there best for my daughters when the Bubble Bursts so to speak.

Thanks in advance.  

Take care

Reply with quote  #41 
If your daughters fear your husband, they may not even admit to seeing the truth, even if it comes out.  If he is found guilty, they may still be too afraid to leave him or to let him accept the consequences of his behavior.  Even if they are not afraid of him, they may continue to have a relationship with him because they do not want to give up the hope of having a father's love.  You may find that they stick by him, even upon learning such an awful truth about him.  I have found that children of Ns are programmed to be much more forgiving than they should be.
Like most children of Ns, your daughters probably have a lot of unmet needs, so they may be more inclined to take whatever is offered from him.  I think the key to helping them heal is to continue offering them healthy forms of love and support, and not forcing them to see the truth until they are ready.  It may simply be too painful for them to face reality right now. 
Over time, they may see that true love is not manipulative or selfish or motivated by fear, but is genuine and life-affirming.  The more you affirm them by letting them have their own feelings and opinions (even if they are not what you would like), the more they will trust that you have their best interests at heart.  It's painful to see our children gravitate toward unhealthy people and things, but sometimes all we can do is let our children have the freewill to make their own choices and then be there to love them when they are ready to make healthier ones.
You may never convince them their dad is unhealthy, but you can convince them that YOU are healthy, by your own words and actions.  All you can control is your half of their parenting.  It may take time, but my suspicion is that they will gravitate toward you over time as they search for real love and acceptance.
I think for now, the best gift you can give your daughters is to give them a really healthy role model.  So make sure you are fixing your own wounds and taking good care of yourself. 
Good luck, and let us know how it goes. 
Reply with quote  #42 
I am a newbie dealing with how to heal and how to deal with my disturbed mother.  I have only really explored it for about 6 months now when she got sick, landed on me like a house, and I had no choice but to save myself.

So far, here is what I am doing to heal:

Limited contact.   I limit my emails to her to generally once a day, even though she floods me with her emails.     I take her to the doctor or help her at her home once a week.  I am learning to tell her no on the other days.

I am "busy" a lot.  I have signed up for classes and I also manufacture busy stuff -  sometimes I tell her I am doing something when I am actually reading a book at home, on the couch.  I am learning to lie.  It is not in my nature, but I tell myself my lies are now for my own self preservation.

I share NOTHING with her besides the superficial, such as the weather, a little something about my classes - things I would tell a total stranger. Nothing much in the way of personal stuff any more because it is used against me.

I share nothing about my finances or health.  I don't tell her how and why she upsets me.  It is futile.

I try to not think of her during the day and I try to tell myself that I am not responsible for her outcomes.

I have a lot more boundaries and am making even more.  Now I plan not to answer the phone when she calls.  She has been calling at 7 in the morning with her complaints, thus ruining the entire day I had planned.  Now I will pick and choose.  Never answer.  Listen to the message.  Decide if it needs to be addressed.

But it is hard!  And ongoing!

pq to cathy
Reply with quote  #43 

my biggest concern is that your ex may have abused your daughters as well.  victims of abuse are programmed by their abusers to never tell, and that can be very difficult to overcome.  is there any family member that your girls trust who might approach them?  or have the police or the prosecutor talked to them to discover whether they were abused, too?

Reply with quote  #44 
This is a wonderful thread! Everyone has terriffic input!

I cannot add much except what worked for me:
                           No contact.

I realize most ACON's do not have that luxury. It is a very hard thing to deal with, at first, even if you find you are able to go NC.

Time and NC make the threat of abuse and predation by your N parent(s) fade into distant, foggy memory. I like it like that. The N's (not just mother but sisters as well) have made their choices. I have made mine. They are strangers to me now. I have no inkling of how their lives are going---and I don't want to know. Contact = pain. No contact = peace.
Reply with quote  #45 

For me, reclaiming my authentic self is what helps me heal.  The freedom to finally be myself-- to say what I want, to say what I believe, not to have to bite my tongue or couch my phrases or ever again "walk on eggshells."  The fact that I don't have to be a phony, baloney person around my mother and sister.  I can be myself.  Totally me.  And it doesn't matter if they don't like it (I can guarantee they wouldn't like it) because they're not in my life anymore.  To finally figure out that it's okay to be me.  In fact, it's not just okay, it's great!    Finallywokeup

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